1 00:00:09,500 --> 00:00:05,809 I'd like to do when we need options for 2 00:00:11,930 --> 00:00:09,510 the show yeah this is where you can 3 00:00:13,940 --> 00:00:11,940 really have it up folks garlic I'll do 4 00:00:15,650 --> 00:00:13,950 an introduction I am and I need you to 5 00:00:21,080 --> 00:00:15,660 pretend that you're actually busy astok 6 00:00:24,650 --> 00:00:21,090 about Trevor Bob's the slide says 7 00:00:28,670 --> 00:00:24,660 especially I am first day ok see you 8 00:00:31,970 --> 00:00:28,680 again hello and welcome to the skeptics 9 00:00:52,130 --> 00:00:31,980 are an episode number 352 for the 19th 10 00:01:09,710 --> 00:00:55,280 welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast 11 00:01:15,570 --> 00:01:12,570 yes we're at the the amazing meeting 12 00:01:17,940 --> 00:01:15,580 here it's as I record this it's Sunday 13 00:01:20,249 --> 00:01:17,950 morning of the amazing meeting Wow right 14 00:01:22,200 --> 00:01:20,259 down the end of this long car door I'm 15 00:01:25,469 --> 00:01:22,210 walking I can actually see james randi 16 00:01:26,940 --> 00:01:25,479 himself at the information desk coming 17 00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:26,950 up on this week's show we have an 18 00:01:31,260 --> 00:01:29,290 interview with well interviews with a 19 00:01:34,280 --> 00:01:31,270 Susan go back from guerrilla skepticism 20 00:01:36,749 --> 00:01:34,290 Tim Farley from what's the harm net and 21 00:01:38,399 --> 00:01:36,759 after the the break with a week in 22 00:01:41,850 --> 00:01:38,409 science from the Royal Institution of 23 00:01:44,100 --> 00:01:41,860 Australia we have Carl Sanders from 24 00:01:46,859 --> 00:01:44,110 carbon dating and will round off the 25 00:01:49,230 --> 00:01:46,869 episode with Jeff wag from the college 26 00:01:51,840 --> 00:01:49,240 of curiosity and look at this it's jay 27 00:01:56,160 --> 00:01:51,850 novella walking past hey has tan going 28 00:01:58,469 --> 00:01:56,170 Jay well hello and there Captain 29 00:02:00,270 --> 00:01:58,479 Saunders no I'm very I'm well I'm good 30 00:02:02,130 --> 00:02:00,280 I'm busy today of course million-dollar 31 00:02:04,230 --> 00:02:02,140 challenge tonight how's your tan be it's 32 00:02:05,669 --> 00:02:04,240 been awesome we had such a good time we 33 00:02:08,219 --> 00:02:05,679 talked to a lot of great people this 34 00:02:10,259 --> 00:02:08,229 year and new venues great it's worked 35 00:02:12,479 --> 00:02:10,269 out pretty well hasn't it as a night 36 00:02:14,310 --> 00:02:12,489 night they made the new del mar bar down 37 00:02:16,289 --> 00:02:14,320 here which is pretty cool yeah right 38 00:02:17,699 --> 00:02:16,299 they converted a little conference room 39 00:02:19,440 --> 00:02:17,709 into the old Del Mar with pictures and 40 00:02:21,539 --> 00:02:19,450 it was really it was pretty cool have 41 00:02:23,160 --> 00:02:21,549 you met my wife oh how do you do I'm 42 00:02:26,910 --> 00:02:23,170 Richard Saunders from Australia it's 43 00:02:30,300 --> 00:02:26,920 very nice to meet you you crazy kids 44 00:02:32,069 --> 00:02:30,310 this is mrs. captain novella oh yes yeah 45 00:02:33,270 --> 00:02:32,079 he's a navigator I'll have to write it 46 00:02:36,990 --> 00:02:33,280 I'll have to write you into the next 47 00:02:40,740 --> 00:02:37,000 episode I think kids to write right 48 00:02:42,180 --> 00:02:40,750 there okay have a good rest of the day 49 00:02:45,290 --> 00:02:42,190 I'll catch up with you later tell the 50 00:02:52,080 --> 00:02:49,620 I'm going to head back to my table my 51 00:02:54,840 --> 00:02:52,090 little information table for the skeptic 52 00:02:56,760 --> 00:02:54,850 zone now on the way I'm going to grab a 53 00:02:59,070 --> 00:02:56,770 coffee and a donut and while i'm 54 00:03:20,120 --> 00:02:59,080 enjoying that I hope you enjoy the 55 00:03:28,590 --> 00:03:22,740 here we are at the amazing meeting tam 56 00:03:31,170 --> 00:03:28,600 13 in 2015 and I'm with ahaha Susan 57 00:03:35,070 --> 00:03:31,180 Kovac from guerrilla skepticism look 58 00:03:37,500 --> 00:03:35,080 there we go and at the same time 59 00:03:38,880 --> 00:03:37,510 skeptics on listeners we're periscoping 60 00:03:41,580 --> 00:03:38,890 live so some of you may have already 61 00:03:43,800 --> 00:03:41,590 heard us and seen this interview as we 62 00:03:46,650 --> 00:03:43,810 were doing it live it's as we record 63 00:03:49,230 --> 00:03:46,660 this it's nearly midday on Thursday the 64 00:03:50,760 --> 00:03:49,240 what is it the the 16th today or 65 00:03:54,150 --> 00:03:50,770 something o.o somebody's is gonna run 66 00:03:56,910 --> 00:03:54,160 down and grab a beer Richard I might 67 00:03:58,350 --> 00:03:56,920 just do that I might so skipping zone 68 00:04:00,090 --> 00:03:58,360 listeners who listening to this on the 69 00:04:01,920 --> 00:04:00,100 podcast we are actually now interacting 70 00:04:04,590 --> 00:04:01,930 with people who are watching us live and 71 00:04:06,210 --> 00:04:04,600 we can answer questions live as we go so 72 00:04:08,490 --> 00:04:06,220 it's a little bit confusing Susan Kovac 73 00:04:10,290 --> 00:04:08,500 hello hello welcome back to the skeptic 74 00:04:12,600 --> 00:04:10,300 zone I am so thrilled to be back on the 75 00:04:14,910 --> 00:04:12,610 skeptic zone who has been so awesome to 76 00:04:16,770 --> 00:04:14,920 the gso w project one of the great 77 00:04:18,570 --> 00:04:16,780 reasons we are the force to be reckoned 78 00:04:21,690 --> 00:04:18,580 with is because of podcasts and 79 00:04:24,180 --> 00:04:21,700 supporters like those in the skeptic 80 00:04:26,130 --> 00:04:24,190 zone we love you now for our skeptic 81 00:04:28,470 --> 00:04:26,140 zone listeners who our new listeners and 82 00:04:30,890 --> 00:04:28,480 for our periscope viewers at the moment 83 00:04:33,180 --> 00:04:30,900 what can you tell me about this 84 00:04:35,340 --> 00:04:33,190 interesting thing that you've involved 85 00:04:38,850 --> 00:04:35,350 with the guerrilla skepticism well we 86 00:04:40,110 --> 00:04:38,860 believe that if you are going to change 87 00:04:41,400 --> 00:04:40,120 the world we're going to have to get 88 00:04:46,500 --> 00:04:41,410 some really good information out there 89 00:04:48,420 --> 00:04:46,510 in a place to the people can find the 90 00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:48,430 answers to questions and citations that 91 00:04:54,450 --> 00:04:51,810 they can follow and actually learn about 92 00:04:57,080 --> 00:04:54,460 whatever the topic it is maybe it's 93 00:05:01,050 --> 00:04:57,090 homeopathy or facilitated communication 94 00:05:04,290 --> 00:05:01,060 or just who are spokespeople are the 95 00:05:06,630 --> 00:05:04,300 escapees own people of all the fantastic 96 00:05:09,890 --> 00:05:06,640 work that's happening in Australia the 97 00:05:12,330 --> 00:05:09,900 Northern Rivers vaccination supporters 98 00:05:14,040 --> 00:05:12,340 group yeah I might have just stumbled 99 00:05:16,710 --> 00:05:14,050 over their name another Northern Rivers 100 00:05:18,870 --> 00:05:16,720 vaccination supporters yeah we just 101 00:05:20,610 --> 00:05:18,880 wrote their wikipedia page and what we 102 00:05:23,100 --> 00:05:20,620 believe is that if we can get the 103 00:05:25,830 --> 00:05:23,110 information on the sixth most amazing 104 00:05:27,750 --> 00:05:25,840 website which is the Wikipedia then 105 00:05:29,670 --> 00:05:27,760 people will be able to find 106 00:05:32,880 --> 00:05:29,680 great information and they can make 107 00:05:35,790 --> 00:05:32,890 their own mind up and find and discover 108 00:05:37,680 --> 00:05:35,800 the answers and so on we're not telling 109 00:05:39,660 --> 00:05:37,690 them what to think basically yeah but so 110 00:05:42,660 --> 00:05:39,670 what you're here at the amazing meeting 111 00:05:44,940 --> 00:05:42,670 because it's just a good place to be and 112 00:05:46,890 --> 00:05:44,950 media people but you're here to two and 113 00:05:48,990 --> 00:05:46,900 I'll be joining you with this because 114 00:05:52,370 --> 00:05:49,000 I'm very keen to hear what you're going 115 00:05:56,190 --> 00:05:52,380 to say teaching people the process of 116 00:05:58,980 --> 00:05:56,200 editing Wikipedia we're finding that a 117 00:06:01,050 --> 00:05:58,990 lot of people are having trouble joining 118 00:06:03,120 --> 00:06:01,060 the gso w project because there is quite 119 00:06:05,490 --> 00:06:03,130 a bit of training involved we teach you 120 00:06:07,290 --> 00:06:05,500 how not only to edit like a wikipedia 121 00:06:13,110 --> 00:06:07,300 editor does but we're also teaching you 122 00:06:15,450 --> 00:06:13,120 how to do edits that are more in the 123 00:06:17,460 --> 00:06:15,460 mindset of a gso w editor we're trying 124 00:06:18,720 --> 00:06:17,470 to teach you a different kind of 125 00:06:20,430 --> 00:06:18,730 philosophy a different way of doing it 126 00:06:21,960 --> 00:06:20,440 still following the rules of Wikipedia 127 00:06:24,150 --> 00:06:21,970 but it is a little bit different than a 128 00:06:26,220 --> 00:06:24,160 normal wikipedia editor would be doing 129 00:06:28,050 --> 00:06:26,230 but what we've discovered is we really 130 00:06:30,870 --> 00:06:28,060 need a lot of people editing Wikipedia 131 00:06:35,190 --> 00:06:30,880 whether they join the GSR w project or 132 00:06:37,770 --> 00:06:35,200 not and I'm finding that there is a lot 133 00:06:39,180 --> 00:06:37,780 of people who are just cannot make that 134 00:06:40,680 --> 00:06:39,190 first step to make the Edit they're 135 00:06:42,750 --> 00:06:40,690 really terrified to make their first ad 136 00:06:45,570 --> 00:06:42,760 I can understand that it is it is pretty 137 00:06:48,900 --> 00:06:45,580 intimidating even especially if you're 138 00:06:50,400 --> 00:06:48,910 not you know in a tech field you know 139 00:06:52,560 --> 00:06:50,410 that kind of thing we want people who 140 00:06:55,020 --> 00:06:52,570 are I get the new a lot of people I 141 00:06:56,820 --> 00:06:55,030 guess would look at Wikipedia but not 142 00:06:59,490 --> 00:06:56,830 necessarily realize you can actually 143 00:07:00,750 --> 00:06:59,500 yeah modify it you can add a message so 144 00:07:02,430 --> 00:07:00,760 I'm going to be doing a workshop here on 145 00:07:04,140 --> 00:07:02,440 Sunday for anybody who brings their 146 00:07:05,550 --> 00:07:04,150 laptops and we're gonna have some real 147 00:07:08,040 --> 00:07:05,560 examples and we're going to help make 148 00:07:09,810 --> 00:07:08,050 their first edits 90 minutes is all I 149 00:07:13,050 --> 00:07:09,820 have and it is going to be really really 150 00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:13,060 hard to get hardly any a lot done in 90 151 00:07:17,660 --> 00:07:15,010 minutes but anybody brings a laptop 152 00:07:20,580 --> 00:07:17,670 should be able to make real edits and 153 00:07:22,140 --> 00:07:20,590 I'm hoping that that will feel their 154 00:07:23,760 --> 00:07:22,150 curiosity they'll go on to be a little 155 00:07:26,700 --> 00:07:23,770 more confident and maybe make more edits 156 00:07:30,270 --> 00:07:26,710 and try to help us change the world 157 00:07:32,490 --> 00:07:30,280 because yeah somebody's asking a 158 00:07:35,010 --> 00:07:32,500 question what did they do if they edit 159 00:07:36,840 --> 00:07:35,020 wrong information well it can be 160 00:07:38,370 --> 00:07:36,850 reverted with about two clicks and we 161 00:07:40,590 --> 00:07:38,380 see this a lot with people who vandalize 162 00:07:43,140 --> 00:07:40,600 Wikipedia pages we can go in and 163 00:07:46,200 --> 00:07:43,150 and change that and not just a gso w 164 00:07:49,230 --> 00:07:46,210 editor but anybody who is on wikipedia 165 00:07:51,450 --> 00:07:49,240 at the moment couldn't go in and change 166 00:07:54,360 --> 00:07:51,460 and edit and that's not a problem the 167 00:07:56,370 --> 00:07:54,370 the beauty of Wikipedia is that things 168 00:07:58,530 --> 00:07:56,380 that are made that are added or 169 00:08:00,000 --> 00:07:58,540 incorrect they can be fixed very quickly 170 00:08:03,360 --> 00:08:00,010 nothing it's not like a printed 171 00:08:05,010 --> 00:08:03,370 encyclopedia and it's it's a pretty it's 172 00:08:07,500 --> 00:08:05,020 a pretty easy process it just works 173 00:08:08,660 --> 00:08:07,510 somehow or other it's managed work i 174 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:08,670 think we're on our twelfth year 175 00:08:14,970 --> 00:08:12,010 wikipedia is existing really mm-hmm only 176 00:08:17,640 --> 00:08:14,980 12 years 13 years i think that's how you 177 00:08:19,560 --> 00:08:17,650 lose time on the internet i think when 178 00:08:21,240 --> 00:08:19,570 things come along I mean this periscope 179 00:08:23,040 --> 00:08:21,250 that we're looking at right now to me 180 00:08:24,510 --> 00:08:23,050 it's very new but I'm not sure how long 181 00:08:27,870 --> 00:08:24,520 it's been around but I think it's going 182 00:08:29,490 --> 00:08:27,880 to get very popular oh I'm very good 183 00:08:30,930 --> 00:08:29,500 thing I mean this is a this is a great 184 00:08:32,550 --> 00:08:30,940 little thing we're doing and we can 185 00:08:34,440 --> 00:08:32,560 interact with people watching us live 186 00:08:36,810 --> 00:08:34,450 and it's quite random because some I 187 00:08:40,560 --> 00:08:36,820 guess you could you could say ahead of 188 00:08:42,980 --> 00:08:40,570 time tune in oh here's a question what 189 00:08:45,660 --> 00:08:42,990 is wikipedias opinion on console 190 00:08:49,620 --> 00:08:45,670 concerted editors that do that or they 191 00:08:52,590 --> 00:08:49,630 see it as trolling no they're the gso w 192 00:08:54,750 --> 00:08:52,600 project is well-trained editors who are 193 00:08:57,420 --> 00:08:54,760 going in and making real edits that are 194 00:08:58,800 --> 00:08:57,430 usually done with a group of people 195 00:09:02,280 --> 00:08:58,810 looking at them before they're made live 196 00:09:04,200 --> 00:09:02,290 and they welcome us the other what 197 00:09:06,720 --> 00:09:04,210 Wikipedia editors are all welcoming to 198 00:09:10,230 --> 00:09:06,730 our group and they welcome the fact that 199 00:09:12,420 --> 00:09:10,240 we are bringing more editors in who have 200 00:09:14,370 --> 00:09:12,430 some kind of training and that kind of 201 00:09:16,470 --> 00:09:14,380 thing so yeah we've been embraced 202 00:09:18,480 --> 00:09:16,480 completely by the Wikipedia community 203 00:09:20,190 --> 00:09:18,490 and you've had to do I mean the work 204 00:09:22,560 --> 00:09:20,200 you've been doing is remarkable now what 205 00:09:25,140 --> 00:09:22,570 what do you think is is one of the 206 00:09:27,090 --> 00:09:25,150 highlights is it creating Wikipedia 207 00:09:28,890 --> 00:09:27,100 pages for worthwhile groups like the 208 00:09:32,160 --> 00:09:28,900 Northern Rivers vaccination supporters 209 00:09:35,160 --> 00:09:32,170 or is it getting existing content up to 210 00:09:37,290 --> 00:09:35,170 date well you know it's a little bit of 211 00:09:39,060 --> 00:09:37,300 everything and it's fun because we're 212 00:09:40,560 --> 00:09:39,070 able to do such a diverse group of 213 00:09:43,320 --> 00:09:40,570 things one of the things we've been 214 00:09:44,670 --> 00:09:43,330 doing lately with gso w is we spent six 215 00:09:47,100 --> 00:09:44,680 months working on anything that has to 216 00:09:49,530 --> 00:09:47,110 do with vaccinations and we've been 217 00:09:51,870 --> 00:09:49,540 working on pages that are pro vax anti 218 00:09:53,380 --> 00:09:51,880 vax we've also been taking pages for 219 00:09:58,950 --> 00:09:53,390 celebrities like 220 00:10:02,010 --> 00:09:58,960 mccarthy alicia silverstone Donald Trump 221 00:10:04,000 --> 00:10:02,020 different people like that who have 222 00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:04,010 anti-vaccination views that we're trying 223 00:10:10,210 --> 00:10:09,170 to make sure what we try to make we get 224 00:10:11,680 --> 00:10:10,220 a little distracting is it before 225 00:10:14,830 --> 00:10:11,690 document you that's really exciting to 226 00:10:17,230 --> 00:10:14,840 teach respect and the question was can 227 00:10:19,330 --> 00:10:17,240 how do we what is better you know 228 00:10:21,370 --> 00:10:19,340 working on that they just do stuff or is 229 00:10:23,100 --> 00:10:21,380 it is it it's a little very modifying 230 00:10:25,390 --> 00:10:23,110 all depends on the kind of time you have 231 00:10:28,120 --> 00:10:25,400 what is this all about for those who are 232 00:10:30,070 --> 00:10:28,130 just joining okay where the amazing 233 00:10:31,240 --> 00:10:30,080 meeting in Las Vegas this is the annual 234 00:10:33,250 --> 00:10:31,250 meeting of the James Randi Educational 235 00:10:36,310 --> 00:10:33,260 Foundation it's for science and 236 00:10:39,180 --> 00:10:36,320 skepticism and things like that and I'm 237 00:10:41,380 --> 00:10:39,190 interviewing Susan Kovac who is from I 238 00:10:42,880 --> 00:10:41,390 hope you can see that the right way I'm 239 00:10:45,180 --> 00:10:42,890 not sure if you can see that reversed or 240 00:10:50,950 --> 00:10:45,190 not but it's gorilla skeptics calm and 241 00:10:53,640 --> 00:10:50,960 what Susan does is help to bring 242 00:10:56,800 --> 00:10:53,650 wikipedia up-to-date make it factual 243 00:10:58,750 --> 00:10:56,810 correct information and create Wikipedia 244 00:11:00,750 --> 00:10:58,760 for worth worthwhile causes and people 245 00:11:04,110 --> 00:11:00,760 right we focus on scientific skepticism 246 00:11:06,910 --> 00:11:04,120 so all things paranormal all things 247 00:11:08,620 --> 00:11:06,920 medical claims not necessarily like a 248 00:11:10,660 --> 00:11:08,630 like a book we wouldn't work on a book a 249 00:11:12,160 --> 00:11:10,670 pity page for a vaccine I mean it 250 00:11:14,380 --> 00:11:12,170 wouldn't want to go in and mess with the 251 00:11:16,420 --> 00:11:14,390 content on the measles vaccine or 252 00:11:18,840 --> 00:11:16,430 something like that we would work on the 253 00:11:20,800 --> 00:11:18,850 Wikipedia pages for people who are 254 00:11:22,870 --> 00:11:20,810 speaking out and talking about 255 00:11:25,240 --> 00:11:22,880 vaccinations and why it's a good thing 256 00:11:30,070 --> 00:11:25,250 or groups that are encouraging 257 00:11:31,630 --> 00:11:30,080 vaccinations or the anti-vaccine firm 258 00:11:34,210 --> 00:11:31,640 ation about why these people believe 259 00:11:36,130 --> 00:11:34,220 this and what is the rationale what are 260 00:11:37,660 --> 00:11:36,140 their arguments and who they are and 261 00:11:39,400 --> 00:11:37,670 what kind of education and training they 262 00:11:41,650 --> 00:11:39,410 dad because that's important information 263 00:11:43,540 --> 00:11:41,660 to get out there also so this interview 264 00:11:45,010 --> 00:11:43,550 that you're watching live now those 265 00:11:47,680 --> 00:11:45,020 people on periscope will be on the 266 00:11:50,020 --> 00:11:47,690 skeptics own podcast at skeptic zone TV 267 00:11:51,940 --> 00:11:50,030 Oh in the coming weeks you know when I 268 00:11:54,070 --> 00:11:51,950 when I started and I'm not very sure I'm 269 00:11:56,890 --> 00:11:54,080 doing lots of interviews here at the 270 00:11:58,660 --> 00:11:56,900 amazing meeting thank you for for 271 00:12:00,550 --> 00:11:58,670 watching yes somebody's just saying 272 00:12:03,110 --> 00:12:00,560 gotta go we'll catch up on the rescue 273 00:12:05,510 --> 00:12:03,120 thank you very much 274 00:12:07,460 --> 00:12:05,520 it's right now this isn't just chance 275 00:12:08,930 --> 00:12:07,470 for me to try out some new technology as 276 00:12:11,230 --> 00:12:08,940 well but yes this interview is being 277 00:12:13,900 --> 00:12:11,240 recorded onto this microphone here and 278 00:12:16,340 --> 00:12:13,910 will be coming out on the skeptic zone 279 00:12:18,140 --> 00:12:16,350 TV well Susan go back thank you very 280 00:12:20,930 --> 00:12:18,150 much for trying this do this is the 281 00:12:25,070 --> 00:12:20,940 first live skeptic zone interview I've 282 00:12:27,230 --> 00:12:25,080 done oh I am in fact oh great I love it 283 00:12:29,030 --> 00:12:27,240 I love it thank you so much for watching 284 00:12:30,500 --> 00:12:29,040 thank you for watching everywhere for 285 00:12:31,940 --> 00:12:30,510 the benefit of people listening to this 286 00:12:33,470 --> 00:12:31,950 on the skeptics and podcast I'm thank 287 00:12:35,210 --> 00:12:33,480 you for listening and we love the 288 00:12:36,560 --> 00:12:35,220 skeptic zone thank you guys well thank 289 00:12:38,180 --> 00:12:36,570 you sooo just absolutely appreciate 290 00:12:40,400 --> 00:12:38,190 everything that you're doing keep it up 291 00:12:42,440 --> 00:12:40,410 guys and I'll be in Australian October 292 00:12:44,480 --> 00:12:42,450 just to mention yes Susan's coming to 293 00:12:46,340 --> 00:12:44,490 the Australian skeptics national 294 00:12:47,630 --> 00:12:46,350 convention in Brisbane in October so 295 00:12:49,340 --> 00:12:47,640 look forward to that yeah and I'm 296 00:12:52,670 --> 00:12:49,350 planning on going to some other places 297 00:12:57,790 --> 00:12:52,680 hopefully going to be speaking to Mary's 298 00:13:02,240 --> 00:12:57,800 in Tasmania possibly New Zealand Sydney 299 00:13:03,920 --> 00:13:02,250 cambria melbourn chem rock I'm bra any 300 00:13:05,900 --> 00:13:03,930 place anybody's gonna let me sit and 301 00:13:07,010 --> 00:13:05,910 talk to you I want to be there so 302 00:13:09,260 --> 00:13:07,020 hopefully I'm going to hit a lot of 303 00:13:10,880 --> 00:13:09,270 other places and check us out eventually 304 00:13:13,100 --> 00:13:10,890 I'll have a schedule real soon hopefully 305 00:13:14,960 --> 00:13:13,110 after this week of where I'm going on 306 00:13:16,519 --> 00:13:14,970 with days all right well from the 307 00:13:19,280 --> 00:13:16,529 amazing meeting at the moment this is 308 00:13:32,900 --> 00:13:19,290 Richard saunas and Susan Kovac thanking 309 00:13:38,390 --> 00:13:35,840 hi this is Tim Farley you probably know 310 00:13:41,180 --> 00:13:38,400 me from what's the harm net a catalog of 311 00:13:43,490 --> 00:13:41,190 the real world harm caused by lack of 312 00:13:46,670 --> 00:13:43,500 critical thinking but that's not my only 313 00:13:49,580 --> 00:13:46,680 project i present at skeptic events I 314 00:13:51,830 --> 00:13:49,590 post a daily skeptic history fact on 315 00:13:54,290 --> 00:13:51,840 Twitter and Facebook and I blog about 316 00:13:57,470 --> 00:13:54,300 using new techniques on the internet to 317 00:14:00,950 --> 00:13:57,480 advance skepticism come over to skip 318 00:14:04,070 --> 00:14:00,960 tools com and check out my latest ideas 319 00:14:08,420 --> 00:14:04,080 but first enjoy the rest of the skeptic 320 00:14:11,270 --> 00:14:08,430 zone yes let's enjoy the rest of the 321 00:14:13,430 --> 00:14:11,280 skeptic zone but first it is live here 322 00:14:15,860 --> 00:14:13,440 at the amazing meeting Kim Fowley hello 323 00:14:17,330 --> 00:14:15,870 Tim hi Richard how are you I'm really 324 00:14:18,950 --> 00:14:17,340 well I'm happy to be at the amazing 325 00:14:20,600 --> 00:14:18,960 meeting it's been a great meeting so far 326 00:14:22,700 --> 00:14:20,610 it's been great yeah this is the 327 00:14:24,550 --> 00:14:22,710 Saturday morning here and it's sort of 328 00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:24,560 the calm before the storm where in the 329 00:14:28,580 --> 00:14:26,730 table area where the vendors and 330 00:14:30,200 --> 00:14:28,590 information tables are and lots of 331 00:14:33,530 --> 00:14:30,210 people having breakfast ready for a big 332 00:14:35,090 --> 00:14:33,540 day sir conventional yeah it's going to 333 00:14:38,390 --> 00:14:35,100 be a big day we had a lot of Martin 334 00:14:43,430 --> 00:14:38,400 Gardner stuff yesterday and today we're 335 00:14:46,970 --> 00:14:43,440 gonna have some food babe lots of other 336 00:14:50,210 --> 00:14:46,980 topics yeah now Oh a skeptic zone 337 00:14:53,390 --> 00:14:50,220 listeners know you other guy behind 338 00:14:55,010 --> 00:14:53,400 what's the harm that's right for people 339 00:14:56,540 --> 00:14:55,020 who may not know can you give them a 340 00:14:59,690 --> 00:14:56,550 little rundown of what that's all about 341 00:15:02,300 --> 00:14:59,700 yeah what's the harm was a to kind of 342 00:15:05,510 --> 00:15:02,310 you know why do we do this skeptic stuff 343 00:15:07,760 --> 00:15:05,520 what is it all about is it you know why 344 00:15:10,100 --> 00:15:07,770 is it important that we explain to 345 00:15:12,760 --> 00:15:10,110 people that ideas are incorrect or an 346 00:15:15,050 --> 00:15:12,770 unscientific and so I started collecting 347 00:15:17,840 --> 00:15:15,060 instances that could be documented where 348 00:15:22,490 --> 00:15:17,850 people got hurt people relied on 349 00:15:24,350 --> 00:15:22,500 homeopathy and and died or you know got 350 00:15:26,210 --> 00:15:24,360 themselves hurt or went to the hospital 351 00:15:28,340 --> 00:15:26,220 or something like that and i have a 352 00:15:30,560 --> 00:15:28,350 whole variety of topics alternative 353 00:15:33,440 --> 00:15:30,570 medicine relying on the advice of 354 00:15:36,560 --> 00:15:33,450 psychics and stuff like that and it's 355 00:15:38,460 --> 00:15:36,570 just a something it's not a website 356 00:15:41,010 --> 00:15:38,470 you'd spend a bunch of time on every 357 00:15:42,870 --> 00:15:41,020 eh but it's a resource that if somebody 358 00:15:44,610 --> 00:15:42,880 asks you that question what's the harm 359 00:15:47,220 --> 00:15:44,620 what's the harm in homeopathy you say 360 00:15:48,900 --> 00:15:47,230 it's just water you can go to the 361 00:15:50,580 --> 00:15:48,910 website and go to the homeopathy page 362 00:15:52,980 --> 00:15:50,590 and see some stories about people who 363 00:15:54,240 --> 00:15:52,990 really got hurt yeah and and all sorts 364 00:15:56,460 --> 00:15:54,250 of things all sorts of things from 365 00:15:58,890 --> 00:15:56,470 homeopathy saved a feelings and faith 366 00:16:00,690 --> 00:15:58,900 healing yeah chiropractic I have a bunch 367 00:16:03,540 --> 00:16:00,700 of chiropractic stories I even have some 368 00:16:06,020 --> 00:16:03,550 Fung Shui stories punctuation [\h__\h] yeah 369 00:16:10,470 --> 00:16:06,030 people got in trouble with on a swag 370 00:16:12,540 --> 00:16:10,480 yeah but that's I should be surprised 371 00:16:14,970 --> 00:16:12,550 yeah I shouldn't be surprised now I 372 00:16:18,120 --> 00:16:14,980 think I first heard about what's the 373 00:16:19,980 --> 00:16:18,130 harm net in 2008 it's like okay yeah 374 00:16:23,370 --> 00:16:19,990 that's about when I started it because I 375 00:16:25,350 --> 00:16:23,380 would have originally met you you know 376 00:16:27,630 --> 00:16:25,360 what at this meeting or maybe dragoncon 377 00:16:30,360 --> 00:16:27,640 way back then write something like that 378 00:16:32,520 --> 00:16:30,370 and so the site was was going then house 379 00:16:34,710 --> 00:16:32,530 has it changed over the years or is it 380 00:16:37,230 --> 00:16:34,720 more of a case of just growing just 381 00:16:40,080 --> 00:16:37,240 growing a lot of what I do now is you 382 00:16:42,570 --> 00:16:40,090 know people tend to use social media now 383 00:16:44,280 --> 00:16:42,580 so I concentrate on posting new cases on 384 00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:44,290 the Twitter feed which is what's the 385 00:16:48,840 --> 00:16:46,450 harm and there's a new case every day 386 00:16:50,130 --> 00:16:48,850 and it's gotten to the point where I 387 00:16:51,750 --> 00:16:50,140 really don't have to do any research 388 00:16:53,790 --> 00:16:51,760 because everybody knows I'm the what's 389 00:16:56,760 --> 00:16:53,800 the harm guys yeah any skeptics sees a 390 00:16:58,590 --> 00:16:56,770 story that's appropriate they send it to 391 00:17:00,680 --> 00:16:58,600 me I'm sure you get people sending you 392 00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:00,690 things from Australia oh yeah absolutely 393 00:17:07,020 --> 00:17:03,490 absolutely but it is it's the wonderful 394 00:17:08,940 --> 00:17:07,030 saying because we hear it ah so often as 395 00:17:11,760 --> 00:17:08,950 being skeptics people will put a point 396 00:17:13,620 --> 00:17:11,770 of view or quack therapy of something 397 00:17:15,630 --> 00:17:13,630 and I get to the point with almost 398 00:17:18,210 --> 00:17:15,640 agreeing that it doesn't work with all 399 00:17:20,930 --> 00:17:18,220 then say well what's the harm right give 400 00:17:23,570 --> 00:17:20,940 a try it what's the harm yeah yeah 401 00:17:26,420 --> 00:17:23,580 and I guess that's what crossed your 402 00:17:28,690 --> 00:17:26,430 mind yeah it actually came out of this 403 00:17:31,870 --> 00:17:28,700 very meaning I the first skeptic 404 00:17:37,190 --> 00:17:31,880 conference that I attended was tam 5 and 405 00:17:38,690 --> 00:17:37,200 I sort of I saw it and it was I enjoyed 406 00:17:40,640 --> 00:17:38,700 it and I saw that there were a lot of 407 00:17:42,260 --> 00:17:40,650 people like me that weren't like famous 408 00:17:43,940 --> 00:17:42,270 authors or anything that were involved 409 00:17:45,560 --> 00:17:43,950 in this and I thought I should I should 410 00:17:47,810 --> 00:17:45,570 get involved in this and I should come 411 00:17:51,020 --> 00:17:47,820 up with a project and somehow over the 412 00:17:53,090 --> 00:17:51,030 next few months after tam 5 the idea of 413 00:17:54,830 --> 00:17:53,100 collecting these stories because what I 414 00:17:56,870 --> 00:17:54,840 noticed was this if you typically see a 415 00:17:58,940 --> 00:17:56,880 story that's of a skeptical attitude 416 00:18:00,740 --> 00:17:58,950 toward one of these topics they'll 417 00:18:03,020 --> 00:18:00,750 always start with an anecdote at the 418 00:18:06,590 --> 00:18:03,030 front of the story and to kind of give 419 00:18:08,420 --> 00:18:06,600 it a human face and I sort of i noticed 420 00:18:11,090 --> 00:18:08,430 that these anecdotes but they'd always 421 00:18:12,830 --> 00:18:11,100 be one anecdote per story and I thought 422 00:18:15,170 --> 00:18:12,840 would be interesting to collect all 423 00:18:17,330 --> 00:18:15,180 those story all those people's names in 424 00:18:19,700 --> 00:18:17,340 one place so you'd see that it's not 425 00:18:21,320 --> 00:18:19,710 just the one anecdote in the story many 426 00:18:25,640 --> 00:18:21,330 people are getting hurt by these things 427 00:18:27,710 --> 00:18:25,650 and how how if you could put a figure on 428 00:18:29,870 --> 00:18:27,720 it from when you sort of started and you 429 00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:29,880 got the original site together in the 430 00:18:36,050 --> 00:18:33,450 original stories how many was that how 431 00:18:38,300 --> 00:18:36,060 many are there now oh yeah I haven't run 432 00:18:40,010 --> 00:18:38,310 the statistics lately but yeah I have 433 00:18:42,650 --> 00:18:40,020 hundreds and hundreds of cases in fact 434 00:18:44,630 --> 00:18:42,660 i'm in the process i've been long in the 435 00:18:46,850 --> 00:18:44,640 process of doing a complete revamp of 436 00:18:49,490 --> 00:18:46,860 how I gathered the data yeah and I want 437 00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:49,500 to update you know how websites kind of 438 00:18:53,690 --> 00:18:51,810 go through different styles and the 439 00:18:56,300 --> 00:18:53,700 style of what's the harm is kind of a 440 00:18:57,830 --> 00:18:56,310 little dated now so I want to update it 441 00:19:00,950 --> 00:18:57,840 make it a little more modern and I'm 442 00:19:02,450 --> 00:19:00,960 going to kind of backfill a bunch of 443 00:19:05,420 --> 00:19:02,460 cases that I haven't gotten onto the 444 00:19:07,970 --> 00:19:05,430 site yet it's interesting so you do rely 445 00:19:10,850 --> 00:19:07,980 on the huge worldwide skeptical 446 00:19:12,890 --> 00:19:10,860 community oh yeah sending you bits of 447 00:19:15,530 --> 00:19:12,900 information and I and I use the you know 448 00:19:17,970 --> 00:19:15,540 and aside from that I use Google Alerts 449 00:19:19,950 --> 00:19:17,980 is a big part of my research 450 00:19:22,860 --> 00:19:19,960 yeah I spent a bunch of time like 451 00:19:24,780 --> 00:19:22,870 figuring out the exact query yeah to 452 00:19:26,970 --> 00:19:24,790 kind of hit the right kind of story 453 00:19:28,770 --> 00:19:26,980 that's interesting and it's I have these 454 00:19:33,210 --> 00:19:28,780 elaborate queries of things like 455 00:19:38,210 --> 00:19:33,220 homeopathy and death or injury or 456 00:19:40,230 --> 00:19:38,220 hospital or and so I have naturopathy 457 00:19:41,820 --> 00:19:40,240 chiropractor and stuff like that and I 458 00:19:45,120 --> 00:19:41,830 get a lot of junk in those in those 459 00:19:47,549 --> 00:19:45,130 queries like I get stories about 460 00:19:50,070 --> 00:19:47,559 chiropractor suing each other over who 461 00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:50,080 knows what ah but they aren't really 462 00:19:53,730 --> 00:19:51,730 appropriate for the site but every once 463 00:19:56,370 --> 00:19:53,740 awhile I find really interesting stories 464 00:19:57,780 --> 00:19:56,380 that way but yeah a lot of it is a mark 465 00:20:00,950 --> 00:19:57,790 Chris lip from science-based medicine 466 00:20:03,330 --> 00:20:00,960 sends me stuff that he runs across and 467 00:20:05,940 --> 00:20:03,340 dr. ray cheese sometimes sends me good 468 00:20:08,520 --> 00:20:05,950 but everybody you know knows I'm know 469 00:20:10,409 --> 00:20:08,530 what's the harm guy so it's funny when a 470 00:20:12,630 --> 00:20:10,419 story makes it big in the news it almost 471 00:20:15,510 --> 00:20:12,640 gets annoying because everyone will send 472 00:20:17,549 --> 00:20:15,520 it to but I appreciate it because that 473 00:20:19,350 --> 00:20:17,559 way I don't miss it it's a good problem 474 00:20:21,360 --> 00:20:19,360 to have yeah it's absolutely a good 475 00:20:22,980 --> 00:20:21,370 problem and as mentioned in your little 476 00:20:25,440 --> 00:20:22,990 promo it's not only what's the harm 477 00:20:27,930 --> 00:20:25,450 eating oh yeah I do a bunch of different 478 00:20:29,970 --> 00:20:27,940 things i have another twitter feed 479 00:20:31,919 --> 00:20:29,980 called skeptic history where i try to 480 00:20:33,680 --> 00:20:31,929 collect interesting little tidbits from 481 00:20:36,210 --> 00:20:33,690 the history of skepticism and 482 00:20:38,280 --> 00:20:36,220 pseudoscience and paranormal people's 483 00:20:42,870 --> 00:20:38,290 birthdays and events and things like 484 00:20:45,590 --> 00:20:42,880 that like yesterday was the anniversary 485 00:20:48,120 --> 00:20:45,600 of the discovery of martin gardner's 486 00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:48,130 asteroid which was an interesting 487 00:20:52,350 --> 00:20:49,450 coincidence because we were doing all 488 00:20:56,640 --> 00:20:52,360 that martin gardner yeah programming at 489 00:20:59,159 --> 00:20:56,650 tam an asteroid was discovered on july 490 00:21:01,919 --> 00:20:59,169 seventeenth 1980 that is now named 491 00:21:04,730 --> 00:21:01,929 gardener for for martin gardner Wow how 492 00:21:08,510 --> 00:21:04,740 about that yeah that's a good 493 00:21:11,120 --> 00:21:08,520 and of course there's a virtual skeptics 494 00:21:13,930 --> 00:21:11,130 virtual skeptics yeah we do that we do 495 00:21:16,940 --> 00:21:13,940 that every Wednesday we do it live on 496 00:21:19,160 --> 00:21:16,950 google hangouts on air and it's a panel 497 00:21:21,530 --> 00:21:19,170 show and it's kind of off the cuff not 498 00:21:23,600 --> 00:21:21,540 quite as polished as as this podcast 499 00:21:25,549 --> 00:21:23,610 certainly because we just do it live and 500 00:21:28,100 --> 00:21:25,559 we talk about whatever's going on that 501 00:21:30,290 --> 00:21:28,110 week and have some fun with it and it's 502 00:21:32,060 --> 00:21:30,300 since it's on Google Hangouts it records 503 00:21:35,180 --> 00:21:32,070 automatically so if you can't join us 504 00:21:37,280 --> 00:21:35,190 yes when it's on I know it's not super 505 00:21:39,410 --> 00:21:37,290 convenient for Australians because it's 506 00:21:42,230 --> 00:21:39,420 on basically early in the morning on 507 00:21:43,790 --> 00:21:42,240 Thursday you know what I'm going to do 508 00:21:46,430 --> 00:21:43,800 is I'm going to get the virtual skeptic 509 00:21:48,530 --> 00:21:46,440 crew to make a new promotion yes and 510 00:21:50,990 --> 00:21:48,540 will we thought you know not only 511 00:21:52,130 --> 00:21:51,000 winners broke up because we broadcast 512 00:21:53,630 --> 00:21:52,140 around the world in fact I'm going to 513 00:21:57,380 --> 00:21:53,640 get you to do every time zone on the 514 00:21:59,030 --> 00:21:57,390 planet well maybe a couple maybe two or 515 00:22:00,799 --> 00:21:59,040 three so people in different regions 516 00:22:02,810 --> 00:22:00,809 especially that's a good idea yeah yeah 517 00:22:04,820 --> 00:22:02,820 can know when to tune in because it's 518 00:22:06,260 --> 00:22:04,830 year they can catch up with it but of 519 00:22:07,820 --> 00:22:06,270 course if it's live it's more exciting 520 00:22:10,130 --> 00:22:07,830 and interesting it's fine yeah because 521 00:22:12,320 --> 00:22:10,140 you can ask questions and we do a trivia 522 00:22:14,620 --> 00:22:12,330 question in it and we announce who guts 523 00:22:18,410 --> 00:22:14,630 the trivia question during the show and 524 00:22:20,390 --> 00:22:18,420 so it's fun you can actually help shape 525 00:22:22,850 --> 00:22:20,400 the show by asking us questions but yeah 526 00:22:25,490 --> 00:22:22,860 if you can't catch it live it's it's 527 00:22:27,350 --> 00:22:25,500 archived on youtube so you can watch it 528 00:22:29,180 --> 00:22:27,360 later and we try to mark it up for 529 00:22:31,580 --> 00:22:29,190 topics so you can search our feed if you 530 00:22:33,020 --> 00:22:31,590 want to see what topics we've we've 531 00:22:35,480 --> 00:22:33,030 talked about that's pretty cool because 532 00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:35,490 only the other day and as listeners 533 00:22:40,370 --> 00:22:37,770 probably know because I probably rented 534 00:22:42,350 --> 00:22:40,380 the bit already I was interviewing Susan 535 00:22:45,919 --> 00:22:42,360 gulberg and we were using periscope yeah 536 00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:45,929 at the same time and people were texting 537 00:22:49,400 --> 00:22:47,730 in questions yeah as I was interviewing 538 00:22:50,960 --> 00:22:49,410 and I haven't done that yet that was 539 00:22:52,580 --> 00:22:50,970 really interested it is it is very 540 00:22:54,799 --> 00:22:52,590 interesting to do the live interaction 541 00:22:57,340 --> 00:22:54,809 yeah well Jim great to see you again 542 00:22:59,930 --> 00:22:57,350 once again here at the amazing meeting 543 00:23:01,760 --> 00:22:59,940 what's the harm net folks that's the 544 00:23:03,860 --> 00:23:01,770 website to go to it's fascinating and 545 00:23:06,500 --> 00:23:03,870 and it is the classic place to go to 546 00:23:09,320 --> 00:23:06,510 when people say well what's the harm 547 00:23:11,450 --> 00:23:09,330 right yeah and you can also make kind of 548 00:23:13,549 --> 00:23:11,460 my sort of central place that I post a 549 00:23:15,020 --> 00:23:13,559 lot of stuff is Sceptile scom that's my 550 00:23:17,690 --> 00:23:15,030 blog skip tools 551 00:23:19,340 --> 00:23:17,700 right so if there's anything else of 552 00:23:21,830 --> 00:23:19,350 mine you want to find usually you can 553 00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:21,840 start there improbably thank you very 554 00:23:44,840 --> 00:23:41,850 much thank you the cosmos is amazing 555 00:23:47,660 --> 00:23:44,850 world famous astrophysicist dr. Neil 556 00:23:50,630 --> 00:23:47,670 deGrasse Tyson is touring Australia this 557 00:23:52,820 --> 00:23:50,640 August inspirational smart and funny 558 00:23:54,770 --> 00:23:52,830 he'll take you on this personal tour of 559 00:23:57,230 --> 00:23:54,780 the universe there are still more 560 00:24:00,590 --> 00:23:57,240 questions to be explored melbourne 561 00:24:02,570 --> 00:24:00,600 brisbane sydney and canberra monster 562 00:24:05,510 --> 00:24:02,580 days in your cosmic calendar for this 563 00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:05,520 once-in-a-lifetime experience tickets on 564 00:24:17,870 --> 00:24:15,800 welcome to weaken science from our oz 565 00:24:20,750 --> 00:24:17,880 bringing you the science you need to 566 00:24:23,030 --> 00:24:20,760 know mining the moon it's a topic that 567 00:24:24,530 --> 00:24:23,040 comes up fairly regularly the idea being 568 00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:24,540 that we can extract minerals from the 569 00:24:32,630 --> 00:24:27,330 moon but is it really feasible let's 570 00:24:34,250 --> 00:24:32,640 look at some of the arguments the idea 571 00:24:36,110 --> 00:24:34,260 to mind the moon and then bring the 572 00:24:39,110 --> 00:24:36,120 minerals back to earth seems pretty 573 00:24:41,840 --> 00:24:39,120 unlikely major issue is just the sheer 574 00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:41,850 cost to launch equipment from Earth into 575 00:24:46,730 --> 00:24:44,490 a low orbit costs around twenty thousand 576 00:24:49,850 --> 00:24:46,740 dollars per kilogram taking it to the 577 00:24:51,740 --> 00:24:49,860 moon be even more expensive and then you 578 00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:51,750 need to ship everything back from the 579 00:24:56,570 --> 00:24:54,930 moon the cost would be far too high one 580 00:24:59,420 --> 00:24:56,580 of the big arguments of mining the moon 581 00:25:01,280 --> 00:24:59,430 is the presence of helium-3 an isotope 582 00:25:04,190 --> 00:25:01,290 of helium which could be theoretically 583 00:25:06,230 --> 00:25:04,200 used in nuclear fusion reactors however 584 00:25:08,420 --> 00:25:06,240 the supplies on the moon are variable 585 00:25:11,060 --> 00:25:08,430 with concentrations in the parts per 586 00:25:13,100 --> 00:25:11,070 billion range considerable areas would 587 00:25:15,830 --> 00:25:13,110 need to be mined to power just one city 588 00:25:18,770 --> 00:25:15,840 for a year and just like fossil fuels on 589 00:25:19,820 --> 00:25:18,780 earth once you mind them they're gone 590 00:25:24,290 --> 00:25:19,830 they're probably not a long-term 591 00:25:26,720 --> 00:25:24,300 solution however what if we use the 592 00:25:29,300 --> 00:25:26,730 minerals on the moon on the moon that's 593 00:25:31,160 --> 00:25:29,310 one idea developing out of moment given 594 00:25:33,050 --> 00:25:31,170 the expense of launching things into 595 00:25:35,660 --> 00:25:33,060 space from Earth there are proposals 596 00:25:38,150 --> 00:25:35,670 that future space exploration departs 597 00:25:40,070 --> 00:25:38,160 from the moon that way minerals mined on 598 00:25:42,260 --> 00:25:40,080 the moon could be refined and used right 599 00:25:44,750 --> 00:25:42,270 there savings from having to transport 600 00:25:46,790 --> 00:25:44,760 materials from Earth this would mean 601 00:25:48,830 --> 00:25:46,800 building a base complete with factories 602 00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:48,840 and everything else needed to establish 603 00:25:53,510 --> 00:25:51,690 a lunar space industry when it comes to 604 00:25:55,790 --> 00:25:53,520 mining the moon in the short term I'm 605 00:25:57,890 --> 00:25:55,800 yet to be convinced but look as 606 00:25:59,750 --> 00:25:57,900 technology develops in the future who 607 00:26:02,900 --> 00:25:59,760 knows what might happen I'm really 608 00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:02,910 excited to find out and now for fast 609 00:26:09,170 --> 00:26:06,810 facts about minerals on the moon the 610 00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:09,180 Apollo moon program brought back around 611 00:26:14,240 --> 00:26:12,450 380 kilograms of moon rocks these 612 00:26:16,430 --> 00:26:14,250 revealed much about the geology and 613 00:26:18,680 --> 00:26:16,440 formation of the moon technology 614 00:26:20,780 --> 00:26:18,690 developed from mining on earth is wildly 615 00:26:23,330 --> 00:26:20,790 unsuited for mining the low gravity moon 616 00:26:25,870 --> 00:26:23,340 a complete rethink of mining technology 617 00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:25,880 and techniques will be required 618 00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:28,410 tranquility ight a mineral previously 619 00:26:32,750 --> 00:26:31,050 only ever found on the moon was recently 620 00:26:35,180 --> 00:26:32,760 also discovered in the Western 621 00:26:37,610 --> 00:26:35,190 Australian outback another possibility 622 00:26:39,770 --> 00:26:37,620 is conversing moon ice into hydrogen and 623 00:26:42,140 --> 00:26:39,780 oxygen which can then be used as a 624 00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:42,150 rocket fuel kind of a lunar petrol 625 00:26:46,790 --> 00:26:44,730 station this seems the most realistic in 626 00:26:49,190 --> 00:26:46,800 the short term that's it for this week 627 00:26:52,070 --> 00:26:49,200 in science for more information on 628 00:26:57,170 --> 00:26:52,080 mining the moon go to the Arias website 629 00:27:00,440 --> 00:26:57,180 are I a USDA you follow us on twitter at 630 00:27:23,580 --> 00:27:00,450 ra oz and like us on facebook i'm ben 631 00:27:28,690 --> 00:27:26,379 well I still hear the amazing meeting in 632 00:27:30,519 --> 00:27:28,700 Las Vegas at the Tropicana Hotel that's 633 00:27:32,739 --> 00:27:30,529 going very well so far I think I have 634 00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:32,749 snuck away here to the depressed room 635 00:27:36,639 --> 00:27:34,730 and along the way I've gathered up Carl 636 00:27:39,639 --> 00:27:36,649 Sanders hello Kyle hey good to see you 637 00:27:42,909 --> 00:27:39,649 again thank you now we met two years ago 638 00:27:45,430 --> 00:27:42,919 the amazing we do is this one is that 639 00:27:47,859 --> 00:27:45,440 when you launched carbon dating and we 640 00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:47,869 have the book right here two years later 641 00:27:53,499 --> 00:27:50,570 it's our first full color collection and 642 00:27:55,960 --> 00:27:53,509 it's kind of a coming full circle back 643 00:27:59,350 --> 00:27:55,970 to tan with the finished product its 644 00:28:01,330 --> 00:27:59,360 carbon comic com folks to check this out 645 00:28:03,129 --> 00:28:01,340 and for those people who may not know 646 00:28:05,739 --> 00:28:03,139 what can you tell them about the comic 647 00:28:07,419 --> 00:28:05,749 strip and the book now carbon dating so 648 00:28:09,430 --> 00:28:07,429 it's a comic strip here in the US it's 649 00:28:12,399 --> 00:28:09,440 usually in the back of our skeptical 650 00:28:13,989 --> 00:28:12,409 Inquirer and it's also translated for 651 00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:13,999 those of you in Germany for the Germans 652 00:28:20,529 --> 00:28:17,690 skeptic magazine but it's a comic strip 653 00:28:23,070 --> 00:28:20,539 about a group of friends and their their 654 00:28:25,810 --> 00:28:23,080 various irrational ideas that they 655 00:28:27,999 --> 00:28:25,820 everybody has you know so the main 656 00:28:29,859 --> 00:28:28,009 character is a science writer and has to 657 00:28:31,389 --> 00:28:29,869 address all of these various things that 658 00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:31,399 come up with his friends over time and 659 00:28:36,639 --> 00:28:33,850 of course there's the romantic interest 660 00:28:39,310 --> 00:28:36,649 as well so a little bit of something for 661 00:28:41,259 --> 00:28:39,320 everybody and all I see it's it's 662 00:28:43,869 --> 00:28:41,269 normally three panels but you've got a 663 00:28:45,700 --> 00:28:43,879 couple that a one penalty you normally 664 00:28:47,230 --> 00:28:45,710 stick to the three billion i do I stick 665 00:28:50,680 --> 00:28:47,240 to the three panel I feel like it's very 666 00:28:52,509 --> 00:28:50,690 easy to write for and you know a good 667 00:28:55,419 --> 00:28:52,519 setup that I try to stick to but 668 00:28:57,430 --> 00:28:55,429 occasionally I'll shake it up for you 669 00:28:59,440 --> 00:28:57,440 know especially a special special 670 00:29:02,200 --> 00:28:59,450 occasion and I see in the back of the 671 00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:02,210 book he'll to we've got some what do we 672 00:29:07,749 --> 00:29:05,090 got debunking handbooks straight from 673 00:29:10,330 --> 00:29:07,759 Australia yeah so a lot and the book I 674 00:29:11,950 --> 00:29:10,340 talk a lot about how difficult it is to 675 00:29:14,009 --> 00:29:11,960 talk to your friends about these things 676 00:29:17,019 --> 00:29:14,019 without causing the backfire effect and 677 00:29:18,159 --> 00:29:17,029 I wanted something at the end kind of a 678 00:29:21,879 --> 00:29:18,169 positive you know 679 00:29:24,460 --> 00:29:21,889 here are some good tools to use for not 680 00:29:26,470 --> 00:29:24,470 causing that not ruining the dinner 681 00:29:28,690 --> 00:29:26,480 party so to speak it's fantastic it's 682 00:29:31,690 --> 00:29:28,700 pages and pages of logical thinking and 683 00:29:33,909 --> 00:29:31,700 debunking and examples all backed up by 684 00:29:36,099 --> 00:29:33,919 cognitive research yeah queensland 685 00:29:39,849 --> 00:29:36,109 university so so it's good for 686 00:29:43,509 --> 00:29:39,859 australians there you go so okay skeptic 687 00:29:45,609 --> 00:29:43,519 calm / carbon if--and comic or the as we 688 00:29:48,369 --> 00:29:45,619 mentioned before the website you're just 689 00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:48,379 lost it the website is carbon comic con 690 00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:50,330 that's right now tell me something about 691 00:29:55,330 --> 00:29:53,090 the process of doing a comics because 692 00:29:57,190 --> 00:29:55,340 I've done a couple in my time for fun 693 00:29:58,599 --> 00:29:57,200 I've written you know that did panels 694 00:30:00,519 --> 00:29:58,609 and tried to thought think of what are 695 00:30:01,779 --> 00:30:00,529 the characters going to say and how am I 696 00:30:04,450 --> 00:30:01,789 going to make it funny in all the rest 697 00:30:08,259 --> 00:30:04,460 of it what's your process well I usually 698 00:30:10,239 --> 00:30:08,269 take a topic that is frustrating me at 699 00:30:12,609 --> 00:30:10,249 the moment you know and try to really 700 00:30:15,279 --> 00:30:12,619 figure out what about that is 701 00:30:17,279 --> 00:30:15,289 aggravating me come up with a punch line 702 00:30:19,090 --> 00:30:17,289 by taking that to an extreme and 703 00:30:20,799 --> 00:30:19,100 starting with the punch line work 704 00:30:22,450 --> 00:30:20,809 backwards kind of the setup in the 705 00:30:24,519 --> 00:30:22,460 second panel and then some background in 706 00:30:27,269 --> 00:30:24,529 the first panel and that pretty much 707 00:30:29,470 --> 00:30:27,279 rounds out the comic writing process 708 00:30:31,599 --> 00:30:29,480 once I've written it then I kind of 709 00:30:34,239 --> 00:30:31,609 assign characters to it like which 710 00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:34,249 character would say that ah and then you 711 00:30:37,479 --> 00:30:35,690 know which characters would be funniest 712 00:30:39,369 --> 00:30:37,489 in this argument yeah and how many 713 00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:39,379 what's your cost of characters I suppose 714 00:30:42,460 --> 00:30:40,730 you can just forget about good about 715 00:30:44,619 --> 00:30:42,470 five main-care guess you can bring up 716 00:30:46,239 --> 00:30:44,629 new characters as you wish actually the 717 00:30:48,159 --> 00:30:46,249 the new characters that I do bring up 718 00:30:50,169 --> 00:30:48,169 are usually supporters of the comic 719 00:30:51,999 --> 00:30:50,179 strip either Kickstarter or that's not a 720 00:30:54,099 --> 00:30:52,009 tree own supporters at a certain level 721 00:30:57,039 --> 00:30:54,109 they get drawn in as a character they 722 00:30:59,979 --> 00:30:57,049 get drawn yeah oh that's fun so you'll 723 00:31:02,470 --> 00:30:59,989 see a lot some random cameos of the 724 00:31:05,619 --> 00:31:02,480 people you may know from Tam many of 725 00:31:07,180 --> 00:31:05,629 them are in the comic so that's pretty 726 00:31:09,609 --> 00:31:07,190 good as a dog in there somewhere I just 727 00:31:13,210 --> 00:31:09,619 know oh yeah yes well there's plenty of 728 00:31:16,389 --> 00:31:13,220 homeopathic pet remedies out there to 729 00:31:18,039 --> 00:31:16,399 talk about to so let's go ahead and it 730 00:31:20,259 --> 00:31:18,049 you've got your own style of course and 731 00:31:22,930 --> 00:31:20,269 it's interesting to see it in color yes 732 00:31:24,999 --> 00:31:22,940 yes free colored a lot of old comics so 733 00:31:28,389 --> 00:31:25,009 this is uh and it's a very similar 734 00:31:30,489 --> 00:31:28,399 palette throughout good yeah we carry 735 00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:30,499 set palette haven't you when I so last 736 00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:31,330 time 737 00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:33,250 when we talked last I was launching a 738 00:31:37,620 --> 00:31:35,530 Kickstarter which was successful it 739 00:31:40,110 --> 00:31:37,630 allowed me to hire an artist and she 740 00:31:43,680 --> 00:31:40,120 came and knows how to do color so we 741 00:31:45,930 --> 00:31:43,690 were able to do color from then on and 742 00:31:48,180 --> 00:31:45,940 we for a few months with that money from 743 00:31:50,820 --> 00:31:48,190 the Kickstarter did five comics a week 744 00:31:51,900 --> 00:31:50,830 every week day which is quite a pace we 745 00:31:54,510 --> 00:31:51,910 did that for a few months until the 746 00:31:55,680 --> 00:31:54,520 money ran out but it that's pretty much 747 00:31:57,210 --> 00:31:55,690 where this book came from was the 748 00:32:00,200 --> 00:31:57,220 support we got there Tim last year 749 00:32:03,480 --> 00:32:00,210 really mm-hmm really that's fantastic so 750 00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:03,490 over the the two years just two years 751 00:32:08,340 --> 00:32:05,610 you've been really doing is right so 752 00:32:10,680 --> 00:32:08,350 because I I keep track of you from tab 753 00:32:12,300 --> 00:32:10,690 to town right morale if ya the first 754 00:32:13,980 --> 00:32:12,310 year was so low I was writing and 755 00:32:16,230 --> 00:32:13,990 drawing I would be like and white 756 00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:16,240 remember yeah man in fact I think I 757 00:32:23,220 --> 00:32:20,170 interviewed you at the if my memory 758 00:32:26,310 --> 00:32:23,230 serves we even stepped outside yeah out 759 00:32:28,860 --> 00:32:26,320 in the desert he tried his ID record for 760 00:32:31,350 --> 00:32:28,870 some reason maybe it was cuz of it was 761 00:32:34,350 --> 00:32:31,360 noisy in elysian I do remember stepping 762 00:32:37,530 --> 00:32:34,360 outside we're roasting hot enough that's 763 00:32:39,120 --> 00:32:37,540 right yeah but yeah so the first year 764 00:32:42,180 --> 00:32:39,130 was so low black and white and then we 765 00:32:44,430 --> 00:32:42,190 hired the least of my artists and we've 766 00:32:47,600 --> 00:32:44,440 been working together since then and I 767 00:32:49,860 --> 00:32:47,610 think it looks just fundamentally better 768 00:32:51,630 --> 00:32:49,870 since when I started out so I'm very 769 00:32:54,840 --> 00:32:51,640 happy about the color and having her 770 00:32:57,840 --> 00:32:54,850 expertise and as it's not it's a good 771 00:33:00,510 --> 00:32:57,850 book it's a nice solid good looking book 772 00:33:02,450 --> 00:33:00,520 and uh but again the color selection I 773 00:33:05,190 --> 00:33:02,460 think suits it very well with the 774 00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:05,200 debunking handbook in the back and there 775 00:33:09,270 --> 00:33:07,090 are many many many many many comics in 776 00:33:11,850 --> 00:33:09,280 here and guest articles as well I am 777 00:33:14,220 --> 00:33:11,860 some some skeptics friends of mine I had 778 00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:14,230 them write some guest articles of their 779 00:33:20,400 --> 00:33:18,130 very various expertise so there are some 780 00:33:22,980 --> 00:33:20,410 different topics that I dive into I 781 00:33:25,740 --> 00:33:22,990 tried to explain really get into the 782 00:33:27,990 --> 00:33:25,750 background with on the website every 783 00:33:31,110 --> 00:33:28,000 time I discuss a topic in the comic I 784 00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:31,120 have referenced commentary and further 785 00:33:35,790 --> 00:33:33,010 reading and all sorts of things to go 786 00:33:40,050 --> 00:33:35,800 with it so the website folks again is a 787 00:33:41,720 --> 00:33:40,060 carbon comic com and is you would still 788 00:33:43,460 --> 00:33:41,730 I'm sure 789 00:33:45,020 --> 00:33:43,470 shed lots of people visiting the site 790 00:33:47,810 --> 00:33:45,030 and helping you out oh yeah and 791 00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:47,820 everything's free online of course yeah 792 00:33:52,130 --> 00:33:50,250 and creative commons so feel free to put 793 00:33:55,070 --> 00:33:52,140 it wherever you like but how can people 794 00:33:57,410 --> 00:33:55,080 get the book it'll be for this is a just 795 00:33:59,450 --> 00:33:57,420 came out two days ago raleigh boating 796 00:34:02,540 --> 00:33:59,460 hats oh wow it will be available online 797 00:34:03,890 --> 00:34:02,550 for sale here once i send out the copies 798 00:34:05,870 --> 00:34:03,900 to all the kickstarter supporters first 799 00:34:07,250 --> 00:34:05,880 farrah don't get it first but in a few 800 00:34:09,770 --> 00:34:07,260 weeks it'll be available for everybody 801 00:34:11,510 --> 00:34:09,780 it so i guess the message is keep an eye 802 00:34:13,640 --> 00:34:11,520 on the website and then you people can 803 00:34:16,160 --> 00:34:13,650 see apps knows about the book fantastic 804 00:34:18,140 --> 00:34:16,170 well called a good for you for keeping 805 00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:18,150 at it when we can see the results right 806 00:34:21,950 --> 00:34:20,490 here good to see you at tam and maybe 807 00:34:38,990 --> 00:34:21,960 we'll see you again next year absolutely 808 00:34:41,240 --> 00:34:39,000 thanks so much that weird sound folks it 809 00:34:44,840 --> 00:34:41,250 could only mean one thing the college of 810 00:34:46,520 --> 00:34:44,850 curiosity and jeff wag hello Jeff hello 811 00:34:48,500 --> 00:34:46,530 thank you Richard for having me here 812 00:34:50,900 --> 00:34:48,510 today we're here at the amazing meeting 813 00:34:53,270 --> 00:34:50,910 and it's great to see here last time I 814 00:34:55,850 --> 00:34:53,280 saw you I was making sure you were 815 00:34:57,650 --> 00:34:55,860 boarding your cruise right in Sydney 816 00:34:59,780 --> 00:34:57,660 when was that suggests yeah i was in May 817 00:35:02,830 --> 00:34:59,790 as we were leaving they were the islands 818 00:35:06,050 --> 00:35:02,840 of New Caledonia how was that that was 819 00:35:10,250 --> 00:35:06,060 unbelievably found a cave behind a 820 00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:10,260 church not a church behind a KO they 821 00:35:13,970 --> 00:35:11,490 said go to the cave behind the church 822 00:35:15,530 --> 00:35:13,980 and we go down its ass anote a and then 823 00:35:17,900 --> 00:35:15,540 you go into a cave and you jump into 824 00:35:20,060 --> 00:35:17,910 this 30-foot pool of clear water and 825 00:35:22,010 --> 00:35:20,070 then when we got back and I researched 826 00:35:24,260 --> 00:35:22,020 it it had all this crazy history whether 827 00:35:26,810 --> 00:35:24,270 he found Nautilus shells in there that's 828 00:35:28,250 --> 00:35:26,820 fresh water ah the Nautilus shells lived 829 00:35:29,750 --> 00:35:28,260 there one of a saltwater and there was 830 00:35:31,370 --> 00:35:29,760 an uplifting and then this freshwater 831 00:35:33,980 --> 00:35:31,380 killed all the Nautilus shells on the 832 00:35:35,870 --> 00:35:33,990 same day and they carbon-dated them and 833 00:35:38,180 --> 00:35:35,880 they knew that they had died six hundred 834 00:35:40,130 --> 00:35:38,190 and something years ago I it was a 835 00:35:45,050 --> 00:35:40,140 fabulous trip but apart from that how 836 00:35:47,790 --> 00:35:45,060 was it ok I had the pleasure of 837 00:35:50,280 --> 00:35:47,800 joining you and I think wow I probably 838 00:35:52,350 --> 00:35:50,290 mentioned this on the skeptic zone in 839 00:35:54,630 --> 00:35:52,360 fact when i met your way back in two 840 00:35:56,970 --> 00:35:54,640 thousand seven I think that's right I'm 841 00:35:59,520 --> 00:35:56,980 Alaska and unless while we met any event 842 00:36:01,140 --> 00:35:59,530 coupe and Baku yes and that's where we 843 00:36:02,730 --> 00:36:01,150 boarded the ship it was the amazing 844 00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:02,740 adventure north to Alaska with james 845 00:36:06,540 --> 00:36:04,810 randi expert now you were on the cruise 846 00:36:08,820 --> 00:36:06,550 your dad your mom and dad that's really 847 00:36:10,350 --> 00:36:08,830 we're on the cruise we have 90 people in 848 00:36:11,880 --> 00:36:10,360 that group now and and that's the first 849 00:36:13,640 --> 00:36:11,890 time I met many people who are still are 850 00:36:15,840 --> 00:36:13,650 good friends so that those cruises are 851 00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:15,850 really good there's some bond that 852 00:36:20,040 --> 00:36:17,530 happens when you travel with people that 853 00:36:22,050 --> 00:36:20,050 doesn't happen any other way naomi baker 854 00:36:23,910 --> 00:36:22,060 yea i meant for the first time kitty i 855 00:36:27,690 --> 00:36:23,920 meant for the Deaf the city was a lot of 856 00:36:29,340 --> 00:36:27,700 a lot of people so let's talk about why 857 00:36:31,100 --> 00:36:29,350 you're here and a bit more about the 858 00:36:33,750 --> 00:36:31,110 college of curiosity and some of the 859 00:36:35,880 --> 00:36:33,760 curiosity or curious things that you've 860 00:36:37,650 --> 00:36:35,890 brought along here today for the 861 00:36:39,870 --> 00:36:37,660 interview we started off with this 862 00:36:44,280 --> 00:36:39,880 strange sound at the beginning of you 863 00:36:46,500 --> 00:36:44,290 what's that all of us sound here so this 864 00:36:48,480 --> 00:36:46,510 is an instrument and it visually you 865 00:36:51,120 --> 00:36:48,490 probably can't imagine what this looks 866 00:36:53,820 --> 00:36:51,130 like yeah but it's a it's a it's a 867 00:36:55,650 --> 00:36:53,830 square of wire with a handle and hanging 868 00:36:58,200 --> 00:36:55,660 off of that square is a flat piece of 869 00:37:00,210 --> 00:36:58,210 metal that it bends and on either side 870 00:37:03,660 --> 00:37:00,220 of that metal are these two mallets and 871 00:37:06,690 --> 00:37:03,670 when they hit the metal I can bend it 872 00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:06,700 and change the tone this instrument it's 873 00:37:09,990 --> 00:37:08,290 a musical instrument it was used in the 874 00:37:12,780 --> 00:37:10,000 jazz movement of the 30s it's called a 875 00:37:14,700 --> 00:37:12,790 flexagon ooh a flexagon and you have 876 00:37:17,100 --> 00:37:14,710 heard this before probably in cartoons 877 00:37:19,140 --> 00:37:17,110 but famously in the movie The Shining 878 00:37:21,660 --> 00:37:19,150 this is the sound that's used to 879 00:37:23,610 --> 00:37:21,670 indicate there are ghosts and that's 880 00:37:26,070 --> 00:37:23,620 what my association when I heard it 881 00:37:27,810 --> 00:37:26,080 first my somewhere the back of my mind I 882 00:37:29,130 --> 00:37:27,820 was taking ghosts yes it is it is a 883 00:37:31,170 --> 00:37:29,140 ghost noise but it was actually 884 00:37:33,180 --> 00:37:31,180 originally invented to be used as just 885 00:37:35,250 --> 00:37:33,190 part of a jazz set be a percussion 886 00:37:36,570 --> 00:37:35,260 instrument and someone would pick it up 887 00:37:42,099 --> 00:37:36,580 to add a little flavor to the number 888 00:37:47,299 --> 00:37:45,109 you could what else do we have here well 889 00:37:49,880 --> 00:37:47,309 we have a couple of other ones this one 890 00:37:51,260 --> 00:37:49,890 here you may have heard before and this 891 00:37:53,390 --> 00:37:51,270 is an interesting thing you cannot see 892 00:37:55,160 --> 00:37:53,400 this I know but it's a tube with a duck 893 00:38:00,339 --> 00:37:55,170 on it it is so what might a tube with a 894 00:38:04,279 --> 00:38:02,660 strangely enough I strangely enough it 895 00:38:05,539 --> 00:38:04,289 sounds like a duck it's a duck call not 896 00:38:07,970 --> 00:38:05,549 the most interesting thing in the world 897 00:38:10,609 --> 00:38:07,980 but cast yourselves back to nineteen 898 00:38:12,799 --> 00:38:10,619 twenties radio when radio was live and 899 00:38:14,900 --> 00:38:12,809 drama was what happened in the evenings 900 00:38:16,609 --> 00:38:14,910 on radio and they needed to make their 901 00:38:25,840 --> 00:38:16,619 own sound effects so it'd be something 902 00:38:30,970 --> 00:38:28,330 and so what you're hearing this is not 903 00:38:32,860 --> 00:38:30,980 thunder it is a thunder to this is made 904 00:38:34,660 --> 00:38:32,870 by the Remo corporation famous drum 905 00:38:38,260 --> 00:38:34,670 company yeah I'm just looking at it now 906 00:38:40,030 --> 00:38:38,270 it's like a well it's a tube yeah with 907 00:38:43,270 --> 00:38:40,040 the opening at one end and out the other 908 00:38:44,770 --> 00:38:43,280 end is a long bit of curly spring you 909 00:38:47,460 --> 00:38:44,780 type walk kind of like the spring you'd 910 00:38:51,670 --> 00:38:47,470 find at the top of a screen door maybe 911 00:38:54,700 --> 00:38:51,680 and it shakes a membrane through the 912 00:39:01,780 --> 00:38:54,710 tube and sounds sort of vaguely like 913 00:39:04,560 --> 00:39:01,790 thunder we do that again oh yeah I'm 914 00:39:06,940 --> 00:39:04,570 getting all this lovely residual sounds 915 00:39:08,500 --> 00:39:06,950 some of those residuals sounds are 916 00:39:11,020 --> 00:39:08,510 interesting because the movie star wars 917 00:39:12,640 --> 00:39:11,030 use them so you hear that sound or 918 00:39:16,960 --> 00:39:12,650 there's that was established yeah here's 919 00:39:18,520 --> 00:39:16,970 a better version this is a very simple 920 00:39:20,230 --> 00:39:18,530 object folks I can't tell you it's 921 00:39:22,660 --> 00:39:20,240 really is a tube with a bit of springy 922 00:39:24,100 --> 00:39:22,670 metal and coming out the end one of the 923 00:39:25,420 --> 00:39:24,110 things that made Star Wars special with 924 00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:25,430 the sound effects and the sound effects 925 00:39:29,650 --> 00:39:27,290 team looked for organic things to make 926 00:39:31,330 --> 00:39:29,660 sounds from and this isn't exactly what 927 00:39:33,640 --> 00:39:31,340 they used but it's the same principle 928 00:39:35,020 --> 00:39:33,650 yeah yeah they used a very long wire and 929 00:39:35,980 --> 00:39:35,030 they hit it with a hammer and it would 930 00:39:40,510 --> 00:39:35,990 made the laser bolts from the 931 00:39:41,560 --> 00:39:40,520 stormtroopers yes I shot Richard it's 932 00:39:43,240 --> 00:39:41,570 all right he'll be all right can I a 933 00:39:46,330 --> 00:39:43,250 stormtrooper net you okay often shocked 934 00:39:48,160 --> 00:39:46,340 me I didn't here's a very very simple 935 00:39:56,560 --> 00:39:48,170 thing that people have possibly heard 936 00:39:58,630 --> 00:39:56,570 many many times will this do this of 937 00:40:00,970 --> 00:39:58,640 course is a slide whistle it's the same 938 00:40:02,650 --> 00:40:00,980 principles a trombone actually except 939 00:40:06,610 --> 00:40:02,660 with a trombone you start with a sound 940 00:40:08,080 --> 00:40:06,620 like this yeah yeah we know but with 941 00:40:10,330 --> 00:40:08,090 this you sound with a you start with a 942 00:40:14,140 --> 00:40:10,340 whistle i whistle and it's just a tube 943 00:40:16,750 --> 00:40:14,150 with a variable plunder able the the the 944 00:40:18,580 --> 00:40:16,760 cavity in there yeah and vibrant yeah 945 00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:18,590 the finger cheesy but this is often 946 00:40:22,300 --> 00:40:20,930 shown to show this often used to show 947 00:40:23,710 --> 00:40:22,310 somebody going up and down a ladder or 948 00:40:25,510 --> 00:40:23,720 falling down or something well that's 949 00:40:27,400 --> 00:40:25,520 right son yeah nice sound effect all 950 00:40:29,080 --> 00:40:27,410 right now this one is my favorite you'll 951 00:40:31,810 --> 00:40:29,090 have to do that over there yeah luck hit 952 00:40:34,890 --> 00:40:31,820 really loves he's walking down the side 953 00:40:44,260 --> 00:40:40,359 one more time over there ah come back 954 00:40:46,240 --> 00:40:44,270 that's pretty good that's pretty cool so 955 00:40:48,570 --> 00:40:46,250 this is a percussion instrument also 956 00:40:52,780 --> 00:40:48,580 from the Jazz movement it is called a 957 00:40:55,359 --> 00:40:52,790 vibe recep it's called a vibrant but it 958 00:40:58,089 --> 00:40:55,369 was invented it has a very strange story 959 00:40:59,380 --> 00:40:58,099 yep originally there was another 960 00:41:02,530 --> 00:40:59,390 instrument that they used to make that 961 00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:02,540 sound and it was a jawbone of a donkey 962 00:41:07,120 --> 00:41:05,210 or a zebra hooked imagine that should 963 00:41:08,950 --> 00:41:07,130 take the jaw of a donkey receiver let it 964 00:41:11,050 --> 00:41:08,960 dry out let all the tissue go away and 965 00:41:12,790 --> 00:41:11,060 the teeth are still in the jaw but 966 00:41:14,710 --> 00:41:12,800 they're loose and they rattle and you 967 00:41:16,510 --> 00:41:14,720 tap the straw with a drumstick or 968 00:41:19,030 --> 00:41:16,520 something like that and it makes that 969 00:41:20,740 --> 00:41:19,040 noise you just heard so why do we have 970 00:41:23,800 --> 00:41:20,750 this new thing that's a call to vibra 971 00:41:25,450 --> 00:41:23,810 slap because it's a bone Jawbone's are 972 00:41:27,370 --> 00:41:25,460 fragile and if you travel with one 973 00:41:29,470 --> 00:41:27,380 they'll break so these bands are on gigs 974 00:41:31,240 --> 00:41:29,480 they get to the gig and they don't have 975 00:41:34,480 --> 00:41:31,250 the jawbone because it's broken so they 976 00:41:36,070 --> 00:41:34,490 invented an artificial jawbone and it's 977 00:41:38,290 --> 00:41:36,080 called the viber slap and you have to 978 00:41:39,760 --> 00:41:38,300 google vibra slap to see what this thing 979 00:41:43,750 --> 00:41:39,770 looks like it's pretty hard to describe 980 00:41:46,120 --> 00:41:43,760 but it's basically metal teeth vibrating 981 00:41:49,180 --> 00:41:46,130 on a piece of wood that's attached to a 982 00:41:52,450 --> 00:41:49,190 piece of wire that acts as the slap part 983 00:41:54,609 --> 00:41:52,460 it's amazing and it looks good shape is 984 00:41:57,450 --> 00:41:54,619 quite interesting and I can hardly know 985 00:42:01,000 --> 00:41:57,460 how to describe the basic shape all good 986 00:42:02,200 --> 00:42:01,010 now lastly the curiosities you brought 987 00:42:03,520 --> 00:42:02,210 this morning and I might have to turn 988 00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:03,530 the gain down on the microphone a little 989 00:42:08,050 --> 00:42:06,410 bit what's this i'm going to start this 990 00:42:12,460 --> 00:42:08,060 because this sound takes a long time to 991 00:42:14,859 --> 00:42:12,470 finish so what you're listening to is 992 00:42:17,230 --> 00:42:14,869 called Euler's disc Euler as a 993 00:42:19,630 --> 00:42:17,240 mathematician and what we have is a 994 00:42:22,420 --> 00:42:19,640 parabolic mirror very slight parabola 995 00:42:24,099 --> 00:42:22,430 and on it I have tipped over what is 996 00:42:26,380 --> 00:42:24,109 essentially a stainless steel hockey 997 00:42:28,720 --> 00:42:26,390 puck all those happy with the market 998 00:42:31,120 --> 00:42:28,730 look very heavy but the mirror is very 999 00:42:33,190 --> 00:42:31,130 smooth and the puck is very smooth and 1000 00:42:34,540 --> 00:42:33,200 has beveled edges so if you've ever 1001 00:42:36,580 --> 00:42:34,550 dropped a quarter in 1002 00:42:38,980 --> 00:42:36,590 walk and spun around that's what's 1003 00:42:41,950 --> 00:42:38,990 happening here but unlike the quarter 1004 00:42:45,580 --> 00:42:41,960 this will keep going and going and yet 1005 00:42:47,500 --> 00:42:45,590 faster faster and faster because there's 1006 00:42:49,630 --> 00:42:47,510 very little friction there's a whole lot 1007 00:42:55,030 --> 00:42:49,640 of potential energy into heavy metal 1008 00:42:57,130 --> 00:42:55,040 agua wow I love that sound Wow let me 1009 00:42:59,110 --> 00:42:57,140 just just the last a little bit again 1010 00:43:05,800 --> 00:42:59,120 just like that yeah a little twist 1011 00:43:07,720 --> 00:43:05,810 before that's satisfying somehow it's a 1012 00:43:09,430 --> 00:43:07,730 lovely sound completely useless device 1013 00:43:10,690 --> 00:43:09,440 this is not a musical instrument I don't 1014 00:43:13,060 --> 00:43:10,700 even think it's been used as a sound 1015 00:43:14,890 --> 00:43:13,070 defend and and the disc itself folks is 1016 00:43:16,960 --> 00:43:14,900 that's quite heavy it's very heavy and 1017 00:43:18,550 --> 00:43:16,970 that's when I do this demonstration for 1018 00:43:20,320 --> 00:43:18,560 people which is why i'm at tim i have a 1019 00:43:21,760 --> 00:43:20,330 table of unusual objects that i'm 1020 00:43:24,430 --> 00:43:21,770 demonstrating trying to increase 1021 00:43:26,140 --> 00:43:24,440 curiosity with the nulls it's a non 1022 00:43:28,120 --> 00:43:26,150 intuitive thing because everyone soon 1023 00:43:29,560 --> 00:43:28,130 everyone seen a quarter drop and they 1024 00:43:31,030 --> 00:43:29,570 know what only lasts a little while but 1025 00:43:33,190 --> 00:43:31,040 they don't know the math behind it 1026 00:43:35,350 --> 00:43:33,200 quarters don't have that much potential 1027 00:43:37,180 --> 00:43:35,360 energy but this really heavy disk as 1028 00:43:39,580 --> 00:43:37,190 waves a few pounds maybe a pound and 1029 00:43:41,620 --> 00:43:39,590 half has enough energy that'll keep 1030 00:43:43,450 --> 00:43:41,630 going and up to two minutes on ideal 1031 00:43:46,500 --> 00:43:43,460 conditions that will spin and it goes 1032 00:43:49,030 --> 00:43:46,510 ten thousand rpms near the adds a good 1033 00:43:50,980 --> 00:43:49,040 are you doing kilos oh to the keto or 1034 00:43:52,690 --> 00:43:50,990 something like that it's a little hard 1035 00:43:54,010 --> 00:43:52,700 to judge but it's whitey you would want 1036 00:43:55,450 --> 00:43:54,020 to get hit in the head with it no and 1037 00:43:56,860 --> 00:43:55,460 it's about the same size as a hockey 1038 00:43:58,960 --> 00:43:56,870 puck and those listeners you don't know 1039 00:44:01,660 --> 00:43:58,970 what a hockey puck is just google that i 1040 00:44:03,400 --> 00:44:01,670 know where hockey puck is having grown 1041 00:44:06,640 --> 00:44:03,410 up a little bit in canada I certainly do 1042 00:44:09,550 --> 00:44:06,650 but there you go Jeff well it's the 1043 00:44:11,920 --> 00:44:09,560 college of curiosity is aptly named time 1044 00:44:15,130 --> 00:44:11,930 you must say and and your adventure 1045 00:44:16,570 --> 00:44:15,140 sound adventurous how can people find 1046 00:44:19,330 --> 00:44:16,580 out well we're at the college of 1047 00:44:21,520 --> 00:44:19,340 curiosity calm we're also at Facebook as 1048 00:44:24,070 --> 00:44:21,530 strangely enough college of curiosity 1049 00:44:25,750 --> 00:44:24,080 and we're on instagram and twitter and 1050 00:44:27,460 --> 00:44:25,760 all those things and just come to the 1051 00:44:29,320 --> 00:44:27,470 website and you'll find us so that's the 1052 00:44:31,690 --> 00:44:29,330 message folks that's the clue hook up 1053 00:44:58,590 --> 00:44:31,700 with the college of curiosity Jeff wag 1054 00:45:07,000 --> 00:45:03,490 hey Heidi oh hi Joe hi Heidi oh hi 1055 00:45:10,240 --> 00:45:07,010 Maynard hi Bernard oh hi Joe nice day in 1056 00:45:14,080 --> 00:45:10,250 this park yeah yes great weather oh look 1057 00:45:16,660 --> 00:45:14,090 a unicorn a unicorn there are no such 1058 00:45:19,840 --> 00:45:16,670 things as unicorns silly yes there are 1059 00:45:22,330 --> 00:45:19,850 no there isn't hey ladies what are you 1060 00:45:25,810 --> 00:45:22,340 arguing about Joe thinks unicorns are 1061 00:45:29,320 --> 00:45:25,820 real they fo are let's look this up in 1062 00:45:31,600 --> 00:45:29,330 the skeptics dictionary the word how can 1063 00:45:33,910 --> 00:45:31,610 we do that in this park there are no 1064 00:45:36,220 --> 00:45:33,920 computers here you ladies probably don't 1065 00:45:39,310 --> 00:45:36,230 know about the skeptics dictionary app 1066 00:45:42,430 --> 00:45:39,320 available now for iPhone iPad and iPod 1067 00:45:44,410 --> 00:45:42,440 touch in the App Store yeah we do we've 1068 00:45:48,610 --> 00:45:44,420 been listening to the skeptic zone for 1069 00:45:50,950 --> 00:45:48,620 years you know yes ok the app lets you 1070 00:45:54,670 --> 00:45:50,960 access all the great skeptics dictionary 1071 00:45:57,490 --> 00:45:54,680 articles when you're on the go yeah let 1072 00:46:00,430 --> 00:45:57,500 me look up unicorns oh cool Heidi 1073 00:46:02,920 --> 00:46:00,440 prepare to be proven wrong it says here 1074 00:46:06,250 --> 00:46:02,930 the Unicorn is a creature from fables 1075 00:46:07,780 --> 00:46:06,260 aha actually I see now that someone just 1076 00:46:10,300 --> 00:46:07,790 dumped their ice cream cone on that 1077 00:46:12,640 --> 00:46:10,310 horse's head thanks get addicted to 1078 00:46:15,030 --> 00:46:12,650 their iPhone app that's just some guy in 1079 00:46:24,800 --> 00:46:15,040 these undies 1080 00:46:28,950 --> 00:46:27,150 thank you for listening to the skeptic 1081 00:46:31,440 --> 00:46:28,960 zone and mr. Randy thank you very much 1082 00:46:34,170 --> 00:46:31,450 for another wonderful convention who is 1083 00:46:36,150 --> 00:46:34,180 this it's a paparazzi coming after you 1084 00:46:38,490 --> 00:46:36,160 with a fuzzy my microphone yes that's 1085 00:46:40,920 --> 00:46:38,500 right yes have you had a good times I've 1086 00:46:43,200 --> 00:46:40,930 had it oh good talent a good time both 1087 00:46:45,090 --> 00:46:43,210 though at the same time yes how do you 1088 00:46:48,750 --> 00:46:45,100 do that I can't explain to you it's a 1089 00:46:51,120 --> 00:46:48,760 complicated art but i must say that last 1090 00:46:53,070 --> 00:46:51,130 night's attributed to brother 1091 00:46:55,080 --> 00:46:53,080 embarrassed me to a certain extent and I 1092 00:46:56,880 --> 00:46:55,090 don't umber know you don't like my 1093 00:46:59,280 --> 00:46:56,890 doubts for that I'm immune to that sort 1094 00:47:03,360 --> 00:46:59,290 of thing about techno it was a hell of 1095 00:47:05,580 --> 00:47:03,370 an evening and I'm very happy to live 1096 00:47:09,120 --> 00:47:05,590 long enough to see this and have that 1097 00:47:11,160 --> 00:47:09,130 contribute offered to me and yes I'm 1098 00:47:12,720 --> 00:47:11,170 quite excited over it was it was not 1099 00:47:14,700 --> 00:47:12,730 only was it a moving tribute it was a 1100 00:47:18,870 --> 00:47:14,710 very entertaining show I thought oh yes 1101 00:47:21,020 --> 00:47:18,880 oh god yes and Marvin Minsky yeah he 1102 00:47:24,090 --> 00:47:21,030 must be a hundred years of age and I'm 1103 00:47:26,190 --> 00:47:24,100 enclosing a letter right now he's sent 1104 00:47:28,650 --> 00:47:26,200 as a matter of fact all sorts of people 1105 00:47:31,830 --> 00:47:28,660 wishing you well and populating you well 1106 00:47:33,810 --> 00:47:31,840 I'll let you enjoy the rest of today the 1107 00:47:34,890 --> 00:47:33,820 last day of town and we look forward to 1108 00:47:36,990 --> 00:47:34,900 the million dollar challenge this 1109 00:47:39,660 --> 00:47:37,000 evening thank you so much and thank you 1110 00:47:42,680 --> 00:47:39,670 and thank you for listening to the 1111 00:47:45,720 --> 00:47:42,690 skeptic zone this week my friends and 1112 00:47:52,030 --> 00:47:45,730 until next time this is Richard Saunders 1113 00:47:58,220 --> 00:47:54,470 you've been listening to the skeptics 1114 00:48:01,130 --> 00:47:58,230 own podcast visit our website at wwc a 1115 00:48:04,580 --> 00:48:01,140 petting zoo TV for contacts an archive 1116 00:48:07,280 --> 00:48:04,590 of all episodes since 2008 and our 1117 00:48:09,190 --> 00:48:07,290 online store please support the skeptic 1118 00:48:12,350 --> 00:48:09,200 zone by following us on twitter at 1119 00:48:15,980 --> 00:48:12,360 skeptic zone liking us on facebook and 1120 00:48:18,170 --> 00:48:15,990 leaving a review on iTunes you can also 1121 00:48:21,340 --> 00:48:18,180 show your support by subscribing via 1122 00:48:24,110 --> 00:48:21,350 paypal for as little as 99 cents a week 1123 00:48:25,760 --> 00:48:24,120 the skeptic zone is an independent 1124 00:48:28,190 --> 00:48:25,770 production the views and opinions 1125 00:48:29,810 --> 00:48:28,200 expressed on the skeptic zone and not 1126 00:48:32,690 --> 00:48:29,820 necessarily those of Australian